Buckeye State Blog - Obama Gets It - Comments

That is exactly what I

Jill — Wed, 10 May 2006 10:58:20 -0700

That is exactly what I thought. The FEC person, no surprise, made it more confusing. Thanks for responding.

Bingo

staff — Wed, 10 May 2006 10:41:41 -0700

prizes for Bryan

technically

bryan — Wed, 10 May 2006 10:13:51 -0700

all political entities are functions of the irs. pacs are under section 527, if memory serves. but, unlike pacs which are subject, by federal law, to the oversight of the fec, 527s are subject to the irs only. the deciding factors in determining pac vs. 527 is the source and purpose of the money they receive. this places 527s in the same legal situation of 501(c) groups.

most non-profits that do political work have 501(c)(3) for public education, 501(c)(4) for lobbying and member-to-member electioneering, PAC for donations to candidates, and 527 for GOTV and public political education.

the issue is not whether emily's list has these four entities -- it's how they worked, together or separately, on this particular campaign.

PACs & such

ratdg1 — Wed, 10 May 2006 10:00:11 -0700

The quote is from a rather unhelpful person at the FEC, who probably didn't know much more than I did about the subject.

Technically, a 527 is not a PAC. 527s are regulated by the IRS (they're named for the section of the tax code they fall under.)

In function, they have the same basic goal: Electing candidates who share their policy preferences.

The main difference has to do with money. PACs can only take hard money, 527s can take soft money. 527s can't coordinate with campaigns or say the 14 magic words, PACs can.

he's saying that

RMC2000 — Wed, 10 May 2006 09:52:18 -0700

the FEC has their heads up their asses. 527s are not pacs, but they can operate pacs. pacs are not 527s.

see: http://www.opensecrets.org/527s/types.asp

Are you saying that a 527 is

Jill — Wed, 10 May 2006 09:07:35 -0700

Are you saying that a 527 is a subset of PACs that focuses solely (in theory anyway) on issues advocacy? From what I read, "political action committee" is a term of art, not a generic term that you'd apply to a 527. But I might be wrong. Nothing that I read indicated that 527s are in fact PACs, though they are groups that advocate for something - although in theory, not for candidates.

What's the attribution for the quote you include at the top of your comment? Thanks.

527s & PACs

ratdg1 — Wed, 10 May 2006 07:56:37 -0700

"All 527s are PACs, not all PACs are 527s. 527s are regulated by the IRS, PACs by the FEC."

I had to do a paper on this, and when I called the FEC's "help" line asking for an explanation, that was the oh-so-helpful response I got, in between demands to know why I was calling and whether I was a reporter:
"Are you a reporter?"
No, I'm a student at OSU and have to do a paper on this.
"You should be talking to our media relations department if you're with the press."
I'm not part of the media, I'm an undergrad at OSU. "Why do you want to know this?"
and so on. Not a pleasant experience.

Essentially what it boils down to, at least in this case:

A lot of larger organizations have created both standard PACs & 527s, as well as various types of 503s.

The PAC handles donations to candidates and express advocacy-this is the hard money end of the table: Limits on contributions from donors to the PAC and from the PAC to candidates, but they can coordinate with the candidate's campaign, the parties, etc.

The 527 is segregated from the PAC, and handles issue advocacy-the soft money stuff. You can give as much as you want to a 527, they can spend as much as they want on ads and whatnot, but can't coordinate it with a candidate, and they can't do express advocacy.

Complex

staff — Wed, 10 May 2006 07:01:37 -0700

I think there are some legit 527's. ACT for example did just GOTV. But the problem is the myriad of 527's where transparancy simply doesnt exist. I'd be much happier if everything fell under the PAC umbrella.

Does coordination entail

scott bakalar — Wed, 10 May 2006 06:09:00 -0700

Financing, coaching, consulting, mentoring, fundraising, recruiting, ordering direct mailings to be sent out via a subcontractor: Ohio Women Vote! ?

"heh" is right

So is the thing, then, that

Jill — Tue, 09 May 2006 20:58:54 -0700

So is the thing, then, that 527s should just be PACs, except that they don't want their donations limited like pacs? OR...are there some legit 527s that truly stay legit and simply focus on the issue? OR does it not matter - issue, candidate, whatever -there should be limits? Or no limits?

yeah

staff — Tue, 09 May 2006 20:56:22 -0700

EMILY's List was involved in recruiting Sutton to run for the seat, according to Esposito, and in constructing her campaign plan. "We sat down her and the local people and the consulting team and figured out a path to victory county by county," Esposito said.

still think there was no 527 coordination ? heh.

Well - I thought I had it straight

Jill — Tue, 09 May 2006 20:43:04 -0700

And then I just read this

Ah, well

redhorse — Tue, 09 May 2006 17:48:17 -0700

then you are a true south sider, aren't you, being a sox fan and all. well, glad your team got through last year.

mine...actually, it's pretty much indians for me now. when wgn stopped carrying every game, I stopped having interest. too difficult to watch very often.

ps - I was j/k about Carbondale. Love the place, but never did more, or have desire than to, merely visit.

Whoa .. I wanna go, big time

Ohio2006 — Tue, 09 May 2006 17:27:27 -0700

That's about all I have to say.

I wish the ODP had the vision and imagination to make an exception to their rules for us bloggers, but since they didn't, I'm glad that Obama is making this gesture, and I'd be thrilled to participate.

Me too

Renee in Ohio — Tue, 09 May 2006 17:15:44 -0700

Demetrius and I have had this discussion. Family is in Chicago, but we've put down roots here. And I hate moving. Yet, if Blackwell somehow became governor...dang!

Obama Gets It

staff — Tue, 09 May 2006 14:57:43 -0700

Just got word that Barrack Obama bought a table for bloggers at ODP's June dinner and will even spend a few minutes chatting with us. What a cool guy.

So if you guys have any questions you wanna ask of a potential future POTUS - drop it in the comments...